Brown Signs Bill to Urge More Drivers into Eco-friendly Vehicles


Suverans2's picture

If consumers could afford Eco-friendly vehicles, the state wouldn't need to provide incentives.

Glock27's picture

Suv--Under the breath we are actually the United Socialist States of America. Another "S" got slipped in around Roosevelts time I think, ergo, the USSA pays for everything (out of your pocket because that money belongs to them and they have discretionary rights to spend--because they know better than we do) Just an observation!!!

Samarami's picture

Hell, Suv2, I've been operating with eco-friendly vehicles for years. Sam

Glock27's picture

One hell of a tote Sam. What'll it cost me for you to tote something from where you are to where I am?? Michigan.

Suverans2's picture

Good looking website, my friend. Best of luck in your new venture. The article, however, was in reference to "electric cars". ;-)

"We're going to lead the way in the fight against climate change by putting a million EVs on the roads, which means making them affordable to all drivers, not just the wealthy." ~ Sen. Kevin de León (D-Los Angeles)

Glock27's picture

As I understand it Ford stopped building the electric car. Does anyone else make them outside of Europe?

Suverans2's picture

From a commenter on this article: "Sticker shock when you buy an EV[1] and a even great shock when you decide to trade this White Elephant in when the warranty on the battery bank is near or past it's warranty. What sane person is going to want to buy one of these EV's when they know the cost of replacing the battery bank? Guess who is going to take the hit when you trade your EV in? It sure won't be the dealer! So much for all that money you saved at the pump :-( PS You are stuck with going to the dealer to have these beast service. I think I'd rather have a root canal!"

According to one source, "On average a 24 kWh battery pack could cost you around $17,000 or so".
[1] Tesla Roadster - The Roadster is the most expensive electric car out there. After the max tax credit of $7,500 it is still a fraction over $100,000. Add in the home battery pack which will be an extra $3,000 plus taxes, tags, etc, the total upfront cost should be around $110,000.

tomcat's picture

Why should a battery / electric car be more eco-friendly than
a car with a standard engine ? Because it has no exhaust ?

1) In a car with a combustion engine fossil fuel is burned,
heat is directly converted into mechanical energy which is
used to drive the wheels.

2)In a car with a battery fossil fuel is burned in a powerplant
(One big exhaust instead of many small).
Heat is converted into mechanical energy which is again converted
into electrical energy which is then (usually over long distances)
transported to the individual household.
There it could be used to charge the battery (another conversion).
Then the battery is discharged(again energy conversion) to provide
the power for the electric motor in the car.

Every Conversion and transportation of energy means an inevitable
loss of energy.

If anyone declares that Method 2) is more energy-efficient than Method
1) (and thus more eco-friendly), then this person should stop wasting
his/her time with electric cars and go right into perpetuum mobile

Glock27's picture

Stupid is as stupid does and Washington 1600 Pennsylvania avenue has a plethora of stupid.

eugenedw's picture

Apparently, it depends to some extent on how the power is generated in the first place:

And of course, while coal burning power stations will still churn out smoke, a city full of electric cars may well have cleaner air.

We root strikers tend to be pretty skeptical about the whole green and carbon footprint issues anyway. I think people bark up the wrong tree here. The conversion to electric vehicles may or may not be a good thing, but in the longer run it is likely inevitable, for the simple reason that cheap fossil fuel will run out. Government won't need to convince (or force) people to make the switch. People will do so themselves as soon as there is no more cheap fuel left for their conventional vehicles, and electric ones become cheaper than gasoline powered ones.

And where will the electricity come from, once we have run out of coal and gas? My guess is mainly nuclear, with generous support from renewables. The contribution of the greens in all this will be to use computers powered by nuclear energy to run Facebook campaigns against nuclear energy. :-)

tomcat's picture

Then it would make certainly more sense
to burn the better fuel directly
in the car engine and avoid all the
conversions and the long ways of energy-
transport of a powerplant+battery solution.

Generally spoken:
I may have left 3- or -in the best case-
4 decades to live and for this timespan
I am rather optimistic about the aviabilty
of something to burn to drive the wheels.
Compared to the Generation of my father
I have had a much higher Quality of
Life and If I go back further in the "good"
old Times of the 19th Century this difference
becomes even larger.
If I take H.G Wells timemachine to get a
average person of this past time to our
present, show him everything and then
ask this individual to make
sacrifices in his own time so that we
in our Present could have a better
Life you may guess the answer.
The future Generation has a very good chance
of e.g. cures against cancer, Parkinson,
Alzheimer, a longer Lifespan etc.
And they will have to find a new source of
energy other than burning oil/coal or nuclear
fission /fusion.

I still prefer a cheaper and faster old fashioned car to a more
expensive and supposedly eco-friendly one.

eugenedw's picture

You are quite right: future generations will have to solve their own problems. Some of these they will inherit form us, but then, we have to deal with problems we inherited from previous generations. That's just how the world works. I am all in favour of not unnecessarily passing on problems to future generations. But then, by doing what we are doing now, we are not just passing along a pollution problem to the next generation. We are also passing along a sound economy, new inventions, advanced science, etc. etc., much of which we are able to do precisely because we have a relatively cheap and abundant energy source.

There are already many people who swear by their electric vehicles, which do have some advantages even in the current world. And this just goes to show that here, as with much else, we can leave the decision to free people operating in a free market. As fossil fuels become scarcer, electric vehicles will begin to make ever more and more sense, and the switch will happen without the government needing to enforce it.

As for the source of power, perhaps future generations will come up with something we cannot even imagine today. But if not, I see no particular reason not to just use what we already have, namely nuclear power, supported by renewables.